The Filing Frenzy

Grace: 00:00:00

Hi Katelyn. I'm back.

Katelyn: 00:00:02

Hey, welcome back, Grace.

Grace: 00:00:04

Thank you for your awesome interview last week. I, that Sheriff, OMG, I am, I love him. He's awesome.

Katelyn: 00:00:12

I do too. I just, I loved every second of it. He seems like a wonderful man and I'm just grateful.

Grace: 00:00:19

And I also learned so much from your piece. I totally forgotten about prohibition and the Tommy guns. Actually, the only thing that I knew about those were from like old movies, where they're like on the bridge and they're having a shootout. It was so interesting.

Katelyn: 00:00:37

Thanks. Yeah, I, quite frankly, taught myself a lot, when I was putting the piece together and I also was giggling about the 1920s, mob, mafia, movies, and I just, I loved it. I think it's incredible that we, can learn something and it sits in the back of your mind and yet at the same time, you don't apply its relevance to everyday life for us. And it's incredibly relevant to what we're dealing with right now.

Grace: 00:01:04

What was so fascinating to me, and maybe we look at doing a piece on this at some point is, during the time of prohibition, How many underground gangs there were and how many people went to jail because of prohibition and the correlation of that time versus now with marijuana., I bet there's some kind of correlation and I wonder, the timeframe of prohibition versus the timeframe of weed being illegal and how many people we've imprisoned over it. That's all super fascinating to me.

Katelyn: 00:01:40

I am salivating at the opportunity to work on that episode with you.

Grace: 00:01:46

Yes. Yes. And I think part of the weed issue, I've heard politicians say this is once we start legalizing weed, what do we do with the people who are in jail for selling weed? Do they just immediately get released, which they should, right? I don't think people who sell weed should be in jail. I think that even a question?

Grace: 00:02:08

I think that actually is a problem in the states that have legalized weed is going back and figuring out, what the sentencing was and was it just specifically for weed and if so, we have to let people out.

Katelyn: 00:02:22

I agree.

Grace: 00:02:23

Your interview on open carry, the sheriff brought up so many things that I never even considered. I, I knew that open carry wasn't in our best interest but when you hear him lay out that a teenager could have a gun in their car, in the parking lot of school, and if something pisses them off, they go out to the car, grab their gun and shoot up the school.

Grace: 00:02:52

That level alone is bonkers. But then for policemen, when they pull someone over there could be four people in the car, six people in the car, all with fully loaded guns and the police have to just deal. I mean, it feels to me like we're just putting our policemen in way more dangerous situations. It's like undoing any safety measure that we had before.

Katelyn: 00:03:19

My question to him was fully predicated on the fact that we can't ignore that there have been race issues with police, in our country and , I don't want to speak for an entire population, but given what we've seen on the news, my assumption would be that the black community might feel safer, not telling a police officer that they have a gun in the car. But I certainly do wonder what. individuals in different communities feel about that portion of the law.

Katelyn: 00:03:49

That all being said, I can completely understand why a police officer thinks that part of the law is ludicrous. Walking up for a simple, traffic infraction and all of a sudden you're in a shootout with a group of people because you didn't know. I just, I can't imagine the anxiety and the intensity that brings.

Grace: 00:04:12

And I don't know if you saw the story this week, Angie Harmon, do you remember who she is? The actress from law and order, she was married to Jason Sehorne. She's one of the most beautiful women in the world. I think she's so pretty. But she, had an Instacart delivery to her house Easter weekend and the delivery person shot and killed her dog.

Grace: 00:04:34

And she says, there was not a scratch on him that nothing happened. His pants weren't ripped. There was nothing. He just pulled out his gun and shot and killed it. And when I read that story, that to me is what this open carry represents is that everyone that has any sort of uncomfortable feeling at any time has a gun in their pocket and can just pull it out and use it.

Grace: 00:05:02

And to the sheriff's point, we don't let anyone drive a car unless you have training. You can be in the military at age 18 and get a gun. But they train you extensively before you get your guns. And I think that weighing this level of extreme freedom versus citizen safety or community safety, this law feels really, unsafe to me. We own guns, we have guns in my house. I am not against guns, but I do feel like everyone should have training to know how to use them.

Katelyn: 00:05:41

I'm not against guns either. I know I talked about the fact that I'm not a gun owner, nor do I want to be a gun owner, but I grew up in Maine. We hunted all of my friends’ families hunted. People had guns for safety. I'm not against guns either, but I'm truly against open carry with no training. That to me just seems.

Katelyn: 00:06:01

It seems, yeah, it seems ludicrous. It seems like we've just gone past the reality of what being free means, right? Because when he was talking about community gatherings, I do not feel safe in gatherings above 50 people at this point. And while that doesn't necessarily always stop me from going, I certainly am hyper vigilant that something is going to happen, especially when there's been, you've been there for a while.

Katelyn: 00:06:30

There's been some alcohol consumption and people's ability to judge what imminent danger is and whether or not they should use their gun or not changes. And that to me just doesn't sound like freedom. That a fact that I always have to be worried about where I am and what other people are doing and whether or not they have guns. I don't know.

Katelyn: 00:06:51

I would actually like to ask, someone who believes staunchly that open carry is better. I am very curious, and my mind is open on why they think that. This brings me to what we are going to talk about today, which is filing. Everyone in the state who is running for office has finished filing as of April 1st.

Katelyn: 00:07:17

One of the things that I would really like to do on this podcast is Interview every single person running for the state house and the state Senate. Give them each 10 minutes, come up with 10 questions that we ask the same questions of every single person. And, in looking through who's running for state house and state Senate, I pulled like everyone that's filed. There are. A lot of candidates and I do want to introduce to today, TJ, our producer, who is always in our ear and telling us things as we do our podcast, but we want TJ's opinion on this as well.

Katelyn: 00:07:58

It's TJ Phillips, y'all, he makes the magic of the podcast happen and his voice is so important. And I think we get to hear it, but our listeners don't always get to hear it. So TJ, I feel like, we need to have your voice on here a little bit more, particularly as we go through the next few months of interviewing, a lot of these candidates.

TJ: 00:08:20

If you don't want to know, don't ask me, because I'll tell you, that's just the way I am. No, I, I look forward to the opportunity. Thank you.

Katelyn: 00:08:31

We love you, TJ.

Grace: 00:08:32

We do love you and TJ, you make us sound smart, so we love you. You even more for that. Exactly. The idea is really to come up with 10 very relevant questions for each of these candidates.

Grace: 00:08:47

And so I think to you, the listener, I want you to give us some ideas of questions as we're formulating what these 10 questions are. The way that you can contact us is, on Instagram. You can send us a message in our DMs and send us any questions that you think we should add in and then we'll compile all of them and we'll come up with the 10 top questions that we want to know from our state house and state senate candidates. On to that, the legislature, Katelyn, have you looked at everyone who is filed?

Katelyn: 00:09:22

I am not as organized as you are, and I'm going to go through the 170 people that you pulled and do some research on them, but what I can tell you is that I feel like there's been a difference in terms of outreach from the Democratic Party to ask people to run in a way that I have not seen in prior years.

Grace: 00:09:43

Did you get the text last week?

Katelyn: 00:09:45

Which text was that?

Grace: 00:09:47

I got a text from, that was a, it wasn't specifically to me. It was a mass text, and it went out. I don't know what day, like Thursday or Friday as they were closing out, you know, the weekend for being able to file that said, are you interested in running?

Grace: 00:10:03

Can you please text us?

Katelyn: 00:10:05

Yes. The number. Yes. I did get that text and was like, absolutely not running. But that being said, I had a number of people who got personal calls in my network who were asked to run for a few different things.

Katelyn: 00:10:18

And I thought, yes, my network has gotten larger, obviously, since I've lived here, but it seemed very targeted and very specific. And I was impressed by that. And I was, grateful to the party for being proactive and trying to get some of these seats filled in terms of running for both primary and general election.

Grace: 00:10:39

So, I'm going to go to this point, which is, something that I think our state could do better and it would be a massive change, but I think that this would make our state more democratic. And that is, we currently have a part time legislature. So what does that mean? That means that you only get paid little over 10, 000 a year. Plus, you get a per diem for the days that you're in Columbia. And you basically, are in session. I think it's from like January to May. And then sometimes you get called back in June or July, depending on what's going on. Think about all of the people that eliminates from being able to serve in the state house or state Senate.

Grace: 00:11:23

When it's. Consider it a part time job, but you have to be available for, four or five months, four days a week and be in Columbia and the pay is just over 10, 000 So who can actually do that? And that's just if you win.

Grace: 00:11:43

The cost on you personally, where you have to go campaign, you have to fundraise, you have to be at events every night, you have to do coffees. I ran for school board in district two in Charleston County, a couple of years ago. And for three months, I did a coffee meeting almost every day.

Grace: 00:12:01

I did lunch meetings almost every day. And then I went to events at night and on weekends. The toll on my family was immense. There's no pay for that. You're basically spending your own money. Plus, you're out asking people for money, which is you do calls all day. I mean, it is way more than a full-time job.

Grace: 00:12:21

And then once you win, it is a lot of work. You have to know the ins and outs of how Everything works. And what's been done up until then. So, I think that paying our state house, a year. It literally is discrimination.

Katelyn: 00:12:38

I also have dabbled in campaigns, and it was a 24 hour a day job. And I on later in the campaign. did it for four months and my wife said to me when it was over, she said, never again, never, ever again. Because people who are passionate about it gets so involved and it draws away from everything else in your life, you know, but to, Representative Wetmore's conversation with you, she is a huge proponent of using campaign funds to cover childcare and elderly care during a campaign and I could not agree more. I think it is so important, like you're going to want your spouse at events with you. It's just good for the campaign and you're going to constantly have to ask people to watch your kids, to cook dinner, to do whatever.

Katelyn: 00:13:29

It makes perfect sense to be using campaign funds to subsidize family, engagement.

Grace: 00:13:36

And that's just one tiny aspect of it. But I just keep going back to can afford to make. 10, 000 a year and live in Columbia four days a week and be away from their family five months out of the year. It literally eliminates the majority of people in our state to be able to run for house and Senate and arguably we are known as a state that has not a strong governorship, but a strong legislature.

Grace: 00:14:05

And those are really important jobs. So, the people that are running our state look like that top tier of people that can afford to do their job from somewhere else can't afford to. Be in session for five months and can afford to be basically work for almost nothing. That really doesn't bode well for us having a representative government.

TJ: 00:14:28

I throw something in here? Yes. We don't need the legislature every day to get together in Columbia. It limits who can be there to mostly older, white guys with monetary wherewithal to make this happen.

TJ: 00:14:45

The internet's here. We can do anything in the world on our computers from our bedroom, from our office, from our kitchen. Why not on a regular basis, have all the debate and discussions via the internet in your district where you can walk out the door and talk to your constituents and come back in and say, okay, I just had lunch with here's what they think.

TJ: 00:15:09

There's no reason we can't do this from, our home office or from our home city and I think at that point you get a lot of people involved that could not have been involved any other way.

Grace: 00:15:20

That would make it so much more representative of our population if we were able to do that. And like you said, T. J. It keeps you closer to your constituents. So you actually have to face your constituents every day instead of, your colleagues up at the state house. So in this current climate of our elections, which in looking through, it looks like there are way more Republicans running than Democrats in the same district. So lots of Republicans are getting primaried. It's going to make this election season all the more interesting.

Grace: 00:16:00

For example, in State Senate District 10, there are one, two, three, four, five, six people running for the same seat.

Katelyn: 00:16:10

And where's District 10, Grace?

Grace: 00:16:12

District 10 is Greenwood Lexington Saluda.

Katelyn: 00:16:17

Okay.

Grace: 00:16:18

This is going to be a fascinating, experiment on our country, but from a micro level on the state. I don't know if you heard Spencer say, basically the Republican party is splitting in two that the freedom caucus doesn't caucus with the Republican party anymore. They have their own thing. There really are like three different parties in the state house right now.

Katelyn: 00:16:40

Which I have to tell you, even though I don't agree with the freedom caucus. on the majority of issues. I am pro multiple parties. I do believe that is a better form of democratic governance and it forces people to work together more, which I'm very big proponent of.

Grace: 00:17:00

I totally agree with that, except how the primary system works.

Katelyn: 00:17:04

Correct.

Grace: 00:17:05

The problem is that a lot of those candidates are winning because the primary consists of the most extreme voters. 7 percent of total voters votes in the primary. So, you wind up getting these extreme candidates that don't actually represent district.

Grace: 00:17:25

And to her point, that's where Democrats might actually have some leeway in this next election. Because a lot of these candidates may be just. too much for, the establishment Republicans that they're like, I'm not going to vote for that person, so I guess either I'll sit out or I have to vote for the Democrat.

Katelyn: 00:17:44

I wonder though, if sitting out is worse for Democrats versus going in?

Grace: 00:17:50

No, I don't think so because there are more Republicans in the state. So the lower the voter turnout, I think is always better for Democrats.

Katelyn: 00:17:59

Got it.

Grace: 00:18:00

I've gotten calls over the last couple of weeks from candidates all over the state saying, can you give me money? Here's my path to winning. And what's funny to me is I have a spreadsheet that I made several years ago, that I update of the districts actually look like so you can see how many women, how many men, how many people typically vote Republican. I love to pull that up. And when a candidate says to me, well, here's my path to winning. I start saying, in 2022, these were the numbers in 2020.

Grace: 00:18:30

These were the numbers. How are you going to get to this number? For example, district one, Nancy Mase's district. Joe Cunningham won by about 4, 000 voters. Since Joe Cunningham won and Nancy Mace took the seat, that district has been redistricted. So Annie Andrews lost by about 38, 000 voters. That district is in front of the Supreme Court right now. And the Supreme Court said we aren't going to have a decision in time for the election. So it stays as it is. unlikely that a Democrat can win that district. I feel like those are the kinds of things that voters don't know and when candidates call you, they're certainly not going to say that. They're not going to tell you that. They're going to tell you what their path is to winning. And if you listen very closely, it usually involves, I'm going to get this group of voters out that has never voted in the past, or I'm going to do X, Y, and Z.

Grace: 00:19:29

So I think as Democrats we need to be asking the right questions of those candidates and understand what the math actually looks like.

Katelyn: 00:19:39

I agree because just based on percentage of population, there are less democratic donors in this state, and they get exhausted by continuing to give to races that are unwinnable.

Katelyn: 00:19:51

And so when a winnable candidate comes to them, they're like, I just can't do it anymore. At least not to the level that they once did, which, then hurts a winnable candidate to make it, a competitive district.

Grace: 00:20:03

That's right. But, I believe in this is anecdotal. This isn't mathematically proven, but the Jamie Harrison race at the time raised more money for any Senate campaign than had ever been raised. And there are all sorts of theories of why he didn't win. It was COVID. He wasn't able to do in person things, all those things, but getting seven mailers in a three-day period for one candidate to me. Voters are more savvy than That.

Grace: 00:20:33

In fact, that turns me off because that says to me, This campaign is wasting money. And I think that the most important thing for any candidate is authenticity. The most important thing that they can do is speak real language. I think that was Hillary's problem.

Grace: 00:20:52

I think that's a lot of candidates’ problems. And so as these candidates are calling, I want to hear who's using catchphrases or who's like actually talking from knowledge and saying their truth. You know what I mean?

Grace: 00:21:07

I want the psychology behind it of how they're saying things and what their connection is to the things that they're saying.

Katelyn: 00:21:14

And there's, a difference between being practiced and being inauthentic. I also want to engage with politicians who really take this seriously and aren't doing this as a pet project because they just can.

Katelyn: 00:21:27

It's a, it's an ego thing, of this are so important to me. Because the reality is. The motivation for you to run is important. is going to determine what you end up doing at the state house.

Grace: 00:21:41

As I said, I ran for school board a couple of years ago and I was defeated by a Moms4Liberty candidate.

Grace: 00:21:47

I did a deep dive into what made them so successful. I mean, they took over school boards all over the country. They didn't spend that much money. They didn't raise tons of money. they but they knew how to coordinate their message. And, before we got on the podcast today, I just went back, I saved a file of all of the emails that people sent me over the course of the campaign.

Grace: 00:22:14

And. Almost every email had the same points in it that had come from a Moms4Liberty text thread that moms in every school in the county had sent out to their friends. They used exaggerated scenarios and they used very specific language that they told the people they were sending it to, if you don't believe me, email the candidates and ask them about critical race theory. Ask them about their feelings about using pronouns in schools. People said the craziest things. One guy sent me an email that said. Do you believe in transgenderfication in the schools? Like this guy made up a word that doesn't even exist. So what I think is so important for candidates to understand is how to message, how to use, good, authentic language that makes people understand what you're saying and what your tie is to it. And to be in person in as many places as you can possibly be, because that's when you can answer real questions.

Katelyn: 00:23:25

While moms for liberty might not have raised a ton of money, you do have, National institutions who are reinforcing what's happening. Whereas, if you look at that list of 170 people who have filed to run in the primaries, there are probably a host of people who have never run before, who do not have staff to give them talking points, who don't have, money for seven mailers. They're not used to fighting against a machine that is coming in and, providing a fully baked foundation for running. There's a little bit of an uneven starting point for some of these people as well.

Katelyn: 00:24:02

And I will say, those politicians that constantly talk to you about fear. There is a reason that they are talking to you about fear. They want to be able to control you once they get into their seats and it's up to us as the electorate to discern what is actually worthy of being fearful of and what are people trying to control me with. don't think the individual who's running, who has no staff and background is trying to convince you of fear as much as those who are backed by national institutions.

Grace: 00:24:39

I did a podcast actually on the message of fear, to do exactly what you said, which is decipher is this imminent danger right now? That messaging of critical race theory it scared white people. Many of them were grandparents that maybe had grandkids in school and, I don't even know what they were fearful of.

Grace: 00:24:59

They had been given this term that they didn't fully understand and then turned it into this boogeyman and started accusing teachers and the former school board of things that weren't actually real. And it became this mob mentality I knew that there was nothing that I could say that, would be a thoughtful engagement on the topic because someone had already created their mindset for them. You know what I mean? It's taken away this ability for, candidates to have conversations about the actual real issues, which is that our reading levels in Charleston County help, they need work. And there were all of these main issues that needed to be taken care of. But these hyper created issues became the talking points.

Katelyn: 00:25:51

One of the things we've talked about before is it's okay to disagree. That means that they don't have to vote for you. But being honest about where you stand on these issues is important. It's also scary. But it's important. I think as we think about people who chose to file this past week, there is a courage level that comes with filing because you are going to be confronted with some of the best and some of the most difficult individuals across the state in your district that you're running in. And it takes a lot of emotional and, quite frankly, physical stamina to stand in front of people who violently disagree with you. Yeah. And continue to be your most authentic self. And so hats off to people who are there, pounding the pavement and doing all of that because it really is what makes democracy tick.

Grace: 00:26:44

I'm really excited about this project we're going to do trying to, interview everyone that's running. There are 170 seats open between the House and the Senate and, multiple people are running, but there are some districts that just have one candidate running so I actually think we have more, 170. That's a lot of time. Grace, what did you sign me up for? TJ, how do you feel about this?

TJ: 00:27:10

I think it's a great idea as long as we interview them all before we start throwing it out there so that we get legit answers and not just a repeat.

Grace: 00:27:19

Oh, that's a good point.

Katelyn: 00:27:21

Look at GO TJ. Just a thought. I'm just saying.

Grace: 00:27:23

Yeah. Yeah. So also, just for, shits and giggles here, we might also need to produce a bloopers, a podcast because we do have some really good bloopers, on this thing, honestly. Yes. Yeah.

TJ: 00:27:37

I don't throw anything away.

Grace: 00:27:40

And Katelyn, that's why you and I will never be able to run for election ever.

Katelyn: 00:27:46

Exactly. I'm sorry. You said what?

TJ: 00:27:50

Going back real quick to what you were just saying about these candidates, like moms for liberty, they don't have to campaign beyond. I'm moms for liberty. Anybody who's interested already knows everything they need to know about them.

TJ: 00:28:03

They know what they're going to support and that kind of thing. So easy to attach yourself to. Now if we pull those people out one at a time and say, okay, talk to me about critical race theory. Without reading the PDF in front of you, tell me what you think this is and why you're afraid of it. They don't have to do that. I don't know, I'm Moms4Liberty.

Katelyn: 00:28:26

They're branded, you're exactly right.

TJ: 00:28:28

They're branded. So they don't have to campaign and spend a ton of money.

Katelyn: 00:28:32

It's why in Europe campaigns are only three months because there's so many parties. It's very clear what you're voting for when you vote for that specific party. Exactly. There, there can be 15 parties running on a ticket for a seat and you're voting based on a very specific set of beliefs and values and we just don't have that here with two parties.

Katelyn: 00:28:53

Because if you're a Democrat or Republican, that's such a wide-ranging group. You could be an extreme right-wing Republican, or a moderate Republican. It just depends on, it depends on what you believe.

Grace: 00:29:06

So you have to be Mitt Romney or Marjorie Taylor Greene.

Katelyn: 00:29:09

Correct.

Grace: 00:29:09

A lot of ground in between.

Katelyn: 00:29:11

Correct.

Grace: 00:29:12

Yeah. Please DM us on Instagram and send us any questions that you have. I am very much looking forward to doing this. So Katelyn, that brings us to a whole nother thing.

Katelyn: 00:29:25

My whole nother thing is that I am part of the Bay Hive and I have done nothing but listen to Beyonce's new album since the moment it came out.

Grace: 00:29:34

When did it come out?

Katelyn: 00:29:35

While cocooning and having the best time of your life, it came out on March 29th and I listened to it all day long driving to Atlanta and then all weekend long, while I was there. Helping a friend and then all the way back from Atlanta to Charleston. I am so obsessed with this woman's ability to collaborate with some of the most amazing minds in a variety of different genres.

Katelyn: 00:30:02

She was right. It is not a country album in its purest form. It is a Beyonce album with country influence, and I am obsessed. There is a piece of opera in, on this album, and it just blows my mind the way that she views genre bending, if you will.

Katelyn: 00:30:20

And people will be like, oh, she didn't write it. Of course she didn't write it. She does what every good artist and leader does. She does it. Gathers people around her who are the best at what they do and creates a piece of art that is so unbelievable. I just, I stan.

Grace: 00:30:34

It's called collaboration.

Katelyn: 00:30:36

Exactly. Collaboration.

Grace: 00:30:37

And I read that she does a cover of Jolene and of Blackbird. Yes. Yeah, which are two of my favorite songs.

Katelyn: 00:30:44

The Blackbird is great. Gorgeous. Jolene, I love how she modernized the words of the song to be a little bit more, shall we say aggressive? And I'm here for it because I love, Her original version of Jolene. I do think that the lyrics are in fact a bit passive and I appreciate Beyonce saying, don't come for my man. No. I'm warning you. Stay away.

Grace: 00:31:10

Dolly Parton is not-

Katelyn: 00:31:12

No, not at all. But Dolly's on the album.

Grace: 00:31:17

Oh, she is.

Katelyn: 00:31:18

She is. She does an introduction and what's cute about it is that she mentions, hey, Beyonce, remember that Becky with the good hair? I had my own, and her name's Jolene and that's the introduction to the new song.

Grace: 00:31:31

Oh my God. I, as soon as we quit recording, I'm going to start blasting that.

TJ: 00:31:37

And Dolly was nothing but complimentary. Yes. Of, of the product. Exactly. And mutual respect, Beyoncé took no credit for any of the word changes. She still listed Dolly Parton as the only writer of the song. Ha! So that Dolly gets every penny for writing the song in the first place. There's a lot of mutual respect between those two women.

Katelyn: 00:31:59

TJ, that just gave me goosebumps. That is such an awesome fact. Thank you so much for sharing that. That made, that just made my day.

Grace: 00:32:06

Excellent. That's awesome. Excellent. I'm going to bring us back, the Kate Middleton story, my Q and on. I'm going to, I'm just going to say that I'm very sorry to hear that she has cancer. But there's more to that story. That's all I'll say about that.

Katelyn: 00:32:22

But wait, you can't leave us there. What is what more to the story is there?

Grace: 00:32:27

There were pictures of William with bruises on his neck that were consistent with someone's hand around his neck. And why wasn't he sitting there with her when she made her cancer?

Grace: 00:32:37

Not like. There's more to this story. I just don't believe that's the end of it. I think there's more. Something went down. That said, my whole, another thing this week is the book "Among the Bros." have you heard of this?

Katelyn: 00:32:51

No, I'm writing it down.

Grace: 00:32:54

At the College of Charleston in the year 2013 there was a fraternity house drug ring that went on for multiple years and culminated in, Elizabeth Moffley's son, Patrick Moffley, getting shot and killed in his doorway on Smith Street.

Grace: 00:33:15

And the book among the bros is a true account of kids that were in the fraternities and sororities at the time that this drug ring was going on. So Xanax is like the pill of choice of college kids because it makes them black out in, relieves they're inhibitions. And so at some point they bought a pill maker and we're lugging this giant machine to rental houses at the various beaches around Charleston, Sullivan's Island, Isle of Palms, and it could make something like 4, 300 pills a day. And they could order all of the ingredients to make the pills online through China and other countries.

Grace: 00:33:57

Ship it here. Make the pills and then distribute them in a ring that covered all of the fraternities in the southeast So there was a group of like this book is -- I read it in, the first two days that I was on vacation, cause I could not put it down.

Grace: 00:34:12

It is the most unbelievable story of how it was set up, how they connected to kids, how they incorporated The musicians that were playing at fraternity party. I like, it's a crazy story, crazy. So I suggest everyone read this book.

Katelyn: 00:34:30

I'm going to go to my local bookstore and buy the book from my local bookstore. Plug for reminder not to buy from Amazon.

Grace: 00:34:38

That's right. Okay. Good one. Good one. And that should end where we go. Thanks everybody. And that's all the stew for today.